Branding As a Spiritual Practice: Building Your Legacy w/ Tiffany Neuman
In this episode with branding strategist Tiffany Neuman, we delve into the art and business of branding. We discuss the pivotal role of connecting with one's true self in the journey of building a brand. We talk about the pitfalls of frequently changing branding strategies and the significance of creating a legacy brand. We also explore the intertwining paths of personal discovery and branding success. I hope you join us in the fun, niche episode.
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Podcast Transcript
Lou: Hello there, friends. Welcome to another interview episode of the Art and Business of Meditation Podcast. I am your host, Lou Redmond. And today we have a branding expert. Tiffany Newman is a visionary branding strategist who helps highly motivated women entrepreneurs up level their businesses. After 15 years in the corporate world, working with brands like FedEx, Adidas and Burt's Bees, she left to establish a revolutionary branding business that stays one step ahead of the trends. Tiffany now works with clients across the globe to help them ten X their sales shine even brighter in their niches. She is a contributor for Entrepreneur and has been featured in Forbes multiple times as a branding expert. Tiffany, welcome to the show.
Tiffany: Thanks, Lou, so much for having me.
Lou: So on my little inquiry that I send out to all podcast guests, you talked about branding as a spiritual practice. So knowing the nature of my audience, I'd love to hear you expand on what you mean by that.
Tiffany: Yeah, absolutely. So I think so many of us, when we hear the word brand, we think immediately of what is the logo, what is the colors, what are the fonts that we're using, and that is the visual manifestation of a brand. But actually what's below the surface, the foundational pieces of the brand are so much more. It's our vision, our values, our voice, the brand story, our personal stories, like, so much more. And what often happens is people will brand for what they think they need to be, to be able to sell their services or what other people told them they should be, rather than who they truly are. And I think the word authentic is a little bit overused, but it's really your genuine self. I prefer that word. And because the world is such a busy place and because we're distracted, even if you do have amazing spiritual practices, a lot of the times we're disconnected from our true selves or our higher selves. And so then the brand doesn't necessarily reflect that. So if done right, I truly believe it's a spiritual process of rediscovering who you truly are. Right? Because we all have past. Like, for me, you mentioned I was in the corporate world and I have kids and I'm a mom. And it's like, okay, who am I really? So we all kind of have these identity crisis sometimes in our lives when we're like, I don't even know who I am and what I'm doing here anymore. What purpose was I brought? Did I come here for? And so for me, that's really how I view branding is going deep and kind of slowing down to speed up.
Lou: In the end what I'm hearing from you is that we get clear on our inner experience, our inner self, who we are. And it's almost like that can then unfold or express itself in the things that most people think of as branding, as the logo and the color palette and all of those things. But it sounds like what you focus on first is connecting with that genuine self.
Tiffany: Absolutely. I think too many people just grab the logos, fonts, and colors and say, that's my brand, and then cobble together messaging. And that's why it never really gels or feels like they can embody it fully.
Lou: What do people. Well, actually, I'll backtrack your spiritual practice or your meditation. Give us a background, I guess, of what that looks like in your life, and then we'll jump back into branding or if there is any aspect of.
Tiffany: That in your life. Yeah, absolutely. Well, it's definitely evolved over time. I would say if you met me in college, it was pretty nonexistent. I went to art school. I started out as designer and a photographer and then really moved into brand strategy over time. And I was the kid who, like, it was a small art school, so I ate out of the vending machines. I did not know health either at that time, unfortunately. So I was, like, 60 pounds heavier. It was a whole thing. But I kind of had an awakening after college and met my mentor, Mary Morrissey, if you're familiar with her.
Lou: I am, actually.
Tiffany: Yeah. And so I worked with her for about 15 years, and she really. Yeah, I learned so much from her, obviously. And I have this whole wisdom library that she gave me of, like, 20 books and meditations and all of the things. So I really am grateful to her for bringing those practices to me. And it's just been ever evolving where now every morning it's like clockwork. I take at least an hour meditation, journaling, downloading, and there's days I skip it and then I regret it. But, yeah, I'm sure it goes that way with a lot of people. It's evolution, where sometimes I'll just do straight meditations. Sometimes. I don't know if you have heard of this thing called quantum jumping. It's pretty fun. I do that sometimes, so it just depends on the day.
Lou: I'm, like, having an image of you listening to something, but you're standing up and you're actually jumping into a portal or something that could really be embodied. Actually, I don't think that's what it is.
Tiffany: No, it's not. But that could be fun.
Lou: That's okay. Idea for my next meditation series is like movement in some ways. Okay.
Tiffany: Yes.
Lou: So you mentioned being in college and not knowing, and I was like, yeah. Because I was so far from anything that I was aware of. We all have our own journeys. I'm sure if you go to an art school, maybe there's some semblance. I feel like art schools, I guess my sister went to an art school, but there's a little bit more, I guess, openness in that way than that's true.
Tiffany: I did really study like world religion and anthropology and stuff like that. So I think it was like the baby steps on the path.
Lou: Yeah, I went to a big ten school, so a little bit different party atmosphere.
Tiffany: I can imagine.
Lou: So what do people think you do versus what do you actually do?
Tiffany: That's a great question. So I think it kind of goes back to how we opened. I think a lot of people think that I am like, thinking about color psychology and blue is trust and that type of thing, which is a tiny portion of what I do. But really what I do is like, the spiritual process is spend time with people and listen to people and uncover what they don't necessarily know is there. So I always say you can't see the label from inside the bottle. It's hard for ourselves to have objective views about ourselves, right? We know ourselves best, but we also don't know ourselves in some ways because we're not having that objective view. So for me, I really tend to serve as a mirror and a guide to help people through the process of that deep spiritual work to find out what is my true voice, what are my values, how do I tell my brand story in a way that really resonates with people? Because that's not what we're taught to do. Right. As business owners, if you're a coach, you're a coach. That's what you know how to do. You're not supposed to know brand strategy. So that's honestly what I do, is listen to people, reflect it back to them, and then strategize how best to take that out into the world and help people find themselves. I guess is another interesting way to say that because I'm trained in a lot of different modalities. So I bring that all into the branding process.
Lou: You mentioned the term brand story before. I'm familiar with the book by was it Donald Miller building a story brand? I actually plan to read it soon. Or plan to, who knows? Soon. Subjective. But is that what you're referring to? And if so, maybe talking about what is a brand story?
Tiffany: Sure. No, I love that I have like 30 books on my bookshelf and I'm like, they will just find their way into my hands at the right time. So I know exactly what you mean. And then they always do. Yes. So Donald Miller actually was so amazing because basically he took. I'm also a professor of design. I haven't practiced since COVID because I didn't want to do it virtually. Um, but I did teach branding for a while and he took the process of creating the brand story, the hero's journey that we've probably all heard of, that's in stories and other things and really showcasing it as his signature process. But truth is, he was brilliant at doing that. It's really the same process that people have been using for ages to tell their stories. Right. The difference is, when we taught it, like when I was teaching as a professor, is he really took it. So it's based on a specific cadence, but it has all the same pieces that any brand story would as like the hero's journey. So who are you trying to reach? What is the process? You are the guide, the client is the hero. What are their pain points? A lot of marketing strategists use the same tools too, right? Like, what are the pain points? What do these people aspire to be? How do they aspire to do it? And then how you can bring that all to fruition, why you use a person that should guide them and that type of thing. So it's really the same process. It was just labeled in a new way, which was really smart. I was like, I wish I would have thought of that book, but, yeah, so that's really what it is rather than your personal story, because storytelling is key, right? So I also help people to write their signature story because you've probably heard, like, your mess is your message. So that's our personal story. The story, brand or brand story is really how you're talking to your ideal client and guiding them through a narrative to then want to work with you is quick summary.
Lou: This might seem like an elementary question, but I can't be the only one that's asking it. What's the difference between marketing and branding?
Tiffany: That's another good question. So really, for me, the brand is the umbrella, if you think of it that way. And of course, no questions are a dumb question, but I think most people probably wonder that. So to me, a marketing is a small segment of your brand. It's how you're getting your message out there. The brand encapsulates everything, right? So if you think about, I don't know, I'm just going to pick like Apple because everybody knows that brand, the brand itself is like we think about the white logo and the thing, but there's so much below the surface that Steve Jobs and co set up as far as what their messaging is. Right. And the simplicity is the ultimate form of sophistication. That's what Apple is, right. Simplicity is the ultimate form of sophistication is how I would describe it. So then the marketing would be like, they're really popular ads. I remember the iTunes ads, which doesn't even exist anymore because technology is moving so quickly. So the technology is the way of the marketing, sorry. Is the way that you take the brand and get it out there. So I really believe that marketing is part of the brand, if that makes sense, it's part of the strategy.
Lou: And I'd imagine it's also brand is built over time. Or is it, if I'm brand new in my field and I'm just putting up my shingle making a website, maybe I'm posting on Instagram, can I come out with brand or does that have to be earned in a way? Do I have to keep showing up to people to understand what is this brand? Does that make sense?
Tiffany: Yeah, absolutely. So in my experience it's both. And you can definitely come out of the gate with a brand in some semblance because it positions you as like you're not trying to figure out while you're figuring it out. Not that you want to fake it till you make it, but it does allow you to pure more professional, especially to look put together, have the visual brand. But a lot of the times, the really deep work that I do isn't necessarily and I'm probably the last person that most people would be like, yeah, you need a brand right away because I'm a brand strategist, come pay me. But I'm a very transparent person. Most of the time, you don't want to invest too much in your brand in that first at least year because you're getting the clients, you're figuring out who you want to work with. Even if you know what you're doing. If you're going to teach meditation, maybe you didn't know exactly who you were teaching it to or what. There's so many of those things. And so I really think of at least getting a year in, but I have people who've come to me after like ten years and they're like, something's not right, this isn't it and then that's why I talk about the idea of a legacy brand, right? Because once you get to that point and you're like, okay, this is what I'm doing. This is where I'm at, then it's time to really invest in a brand that's going to be like an apple or one of those legacy brands that's going to last and you'll evolve and change, but you can just make tiny tweaks rather than you see some people online and they literally have a new brand every year, every time they make a new offer, and it confuses the audience. To sum it up, I don't necessarily think it's a good idea to invest heavily right away, but then the longer you wait, then the more you're not investing in your long term. Because if you think about the people that we admire online that have been doing this forever, like a Marie Forleo or something, she built that brand. She owns it. Oprah, Tony Robbins, like, all of those people, they own that brand and that's their asset. Yes, they have their IP and things like that, but the brand is really what's the living entity?
Lou: And so ten years, or I guess when you say, like someone having a new brand every time they launch a product, what would that look like? Is that just new, different? I'm still trying to grasp my head around. Is it like they just change all the colors and then I know that's not what branding is only. Or is it just a completely different offer? Like, one day I'm known as the person that helps meditation teachers get classes, and then on the other day I'm doing essential oils or something. Like, is that like, is it something like that?
Tiffany: Like, yeah, usually that's the case. And, you know, there are multipassionates out there. Like, there's. That's why I also don't recommend everybody's like, you got to find your niche. You got to go deep into a niche and that's how you're going to get successful. Sometimes that doesn't work either. And I have actually helped people reverse out of their niche because they niched so deep that they get sick and tired of doing the same thing all the time. So it can be one way or the other. A lot of the times it is the visual and they're changing the language. And I won't name names, but there was one person that I've been following, well, I don't think anybody would know who she is because literally every year it's like a whole new visual identity. A whole new messaging strategy, which means her audience is completely different. And that's where it's okay to evolve and pivot, because we're all going to change over time. But if you completely reinvent the wheel every time, then you're never going to gain that traction. To truly get to a place where there's so many people that we see that seem to come out of nowhere. The truth is, they've been building that brand slowly and methodically over the years, and they've created that legacy. Know, and so if you're constantly changing, that's it. It just doesn't gain that traction. Typically.
Lou: You mentioned a Tony Robbins, a Marie Forleo. Is their brand. Their like, what else encompasses those two specifically? Because I have.
Tiffany: Yeah, so with those two specifically, it would be, well, so Marie actually, and I'll just use her only because I'm not affiliated. I have no dislike or dislike or anything, but it's just because most people know who she is. It's Marie. But it was also B school. Right, because she built a brand around B school. So for me, a lot of times people have a question of, like, should I build a brand around my name, or should I build a brand around a thing or like B school, because maybe I want to sell it someday. I like to say both. And right, because you are the thought leader. You are the person. So Marie now has time. Genius. And yes, she still has B school, but if she wanted to get rid of B school or sell B school or anything like that, her brand is still Marie like. It's her personality, it's who she is, it's how she shows up. It's her stories, it's how she shows up in the world. It's like, really, the energetics of her, right. Brands really have an energy behind them. So that's the cool thing, is she got known for B School, but that's not the brand necessarily. That's the product. Now she has time. Genius. But it's really important to have a strong brand around. Like, if you want to get to the level where you're known for the B school, it's good to have its own brand, too. So she used to have a B school website and a Marie Folio site. So a lot of times I actually recommend that for people who are really working on becoming thought leaders, is that they have their brand, but then they still have their products that they could sell someday.
Lou: Got it. So eight years, let's say. For me, being in this world, I've worked with a website designer who I guess acts as a pseudo brand helper. Maybe that's also something that you have issue with. Maybe I'm imagining because it's not specific, they're more so on the website design. So if I were wanting to create and be like, okay, I want to be more intentional, my brand, I want to create a legacy brand. How do you invite or shift someone who's already doing it for a little while to actually create that legacy brand? And maybe you've already been talking about it. So I'm sorry if I'm asking you the same question over and over.
Tiffany: Totally good. It's all relevant. So basically we look at, and honestly, that's a lot of people that I get because they're like, okay, I'm really ready to go to that next level, be seen as a thought leader, speak on stages, all of those things, they're like, this has served me very well and I got very far in my journey and now I want to go to the next level. So typically what we do is either have an intensive or have a group program that we walk through that through. So somebody at your level would typically be like a one on one client where we just sit down together and we look at, okay, well, things have been working to get you this far, right? So it's not like you have to completely reinvent everything. We really strategize and look at what's been working and what no longer serves you, and then how we can make it better and really make your message a movement. That's the whole point of a legacy brand, too, is to not just make it sellable and everything, but to create a movement. So then people really want to get behind it and it just takes off in a whole new way. And then that leads to, again, getting those foundations in place. And then from there, we still do the visual pieces. But I truly believe you have to get clear on those foundations first before the visual manifestation, because you learn so much about a person and who they actually are during that deep dive. So then the visual piece just becomes really obvious. So if you go to my website, some brand designers or website designers, their stuff all kind of looks the same because it's their aesthetic, right? And you may like, ooh, they have a good aesthetic. So I'm going to hire them and that's cool. But if you look at our portfolio, every person looks completely different and completely unique, and it really captures their essence because we've done that deep work first.
Lou: Okay, so I'm going to ask you a meta question. What is your brand?
Tiffany: My brand. So, well, kind of what I was just speaking about, I have the Tiffany Newman brand, which actually, we are redoing that website right now because I'm going to go on a speaking circuit starting next year. So I wanted to up level that website, and then it's your legacy brand. So kind of, like I said with have, I'm the thought leader Newman. I go on podcasts and I write and I do all the things, but my framework and what I'm serving people with is your legacy brand. And so that's really what allows people to step into their legacy brand.
Lou: So let's backtrack now. Now that we've explored someone who's been doing it for a while, but many people listening are newer to any of this, so before they would even want to hire anyone or think about any higher level strategy for branding, what could someone do on their own to start developing or thinking about their brand on their own? Intentionally?
Tiffany: Yeah. I mean, to be super transparent, I would do what most people do and just go on Fiver and get a logo and just make yourself look presentable at first. So people like, there is that trust factor, right? If your stuff looks super off, then you don't want to do that. And then also take a lOok. That's where that first year especially is really important, to just get in front of clients and ask as many questions as you can and start noticing their language. The most powerful thing that you can do is repeat back people's language to them so they're hearing their own words. So that's a lot of the brand strategy that we do, too, is when I worked in the corporate world, these corporations would spend millions and millions of dollars on market research, and we would spend a lot of time if we were coming out with a new skincare brand for Burt's bees or a new line of clothes for Adidas of what is this ideal client? How would they describe that and those types of things, rather than just trying to make it up. And I think a lot of newer entrepreneurs use their experience because a lot of times we teach what we most need. Right. They use their experience and their words to attract clients. So from the messaging standpoint, it's really about working with many people as possible and getting new clients. Or if you're not getting clients yet, just interviewing people, hey, can I ask you some questions about this? And use like a fathom AI or something. Record it, pull out the pieces. And I always say that entrepreneurs build the plane while they're flying it. And that's actually serves us well, until you get to a certain point. And then I'd say once you're like a year or two in and you've got some traction, you're like, okay, I know what I'm doing. Then it's time to invest. That's why I have a group program for those people who are a little bit newer and there's not as much to dig into. I actually do that foundational work as a group together because that serves as market research in real time. It's pretty cool to see people coming together and learning from each other and then I still make the brand strategy for them personally.
Lou: Was it challenging to move from corporate to having your own business, or was it a smooth shift?
Tiffany: Man, you have the best questions. It was difficult, I'm not going to lie. Yeah, well, I Think it's the case for so many people, right? You do something. I had my dream job. I was like traveling to New York and Chicago and LA and working for these awesome brands. Through the tools that you teach and other tools, I had manifested my dream. It was amazing. Well, then I had my daughter. So for those people listening, have children kind of changes your whole life in the best ways. But I found myself leaving my six month old and I'm like, oh, this is no longer fun for me. So I was like, okay, I have the credibility, I have the skills, but it's so different when you are behind the scenes of something else and when you're putting. So speaking brand wise, I was a brand expert behind the scenes. Well, now all of a sudden I have to put myself as an introvert online and talk about myself and do all the things. So I always say, if I can do this, anybody can. Because, yes, I was a brand strategist, but I was like the last person that wanted to my face online and promoting. But I was like, okay, I have to do this if I have to do it. So there was a lot of mindset things to work through and making that leap. But actually, I don't know if you've ever heard of the book you squared. It's about quantum leaps, I think I read that book. It's like this thick. It's actually right here. It's like really tiny, really thick. The COVID fell off because I think I read it so many times. So I would read like a spread of this every day and like, okay, just focus, like, we've got this. Yeah. So if anybody else has made that jump, it's intense, but it's so rewarding and so worth it. And I wouldn't have traded anything for it. Now, like five years in, I would not change a minute.
Lou: Was it like you have money in the bank and then you go from zero to like, all right, now I got to get clients. Did you start getting clients while you were working or did you really create that shift?
Tiffany: Great question. I actually convinced. So I had worked my way up to creative director and I was lucky. I was kind of the only one who knew all the things in my department because I had built it. So if I would have left, it would have kind of thrown them for a loop. So I proposed them that I would move down to part time and hire and train my replacement over a year. And then while I was part time, I was able to start getting clients. And then when I left there, I got another local creative direction job. Not even part time, but just, yeah, for me, it was just more comfortable to make the leap. I know a lot of people are just like, I'm going to do this and go straight into it. I didn't have the savings as much as I wanted, so I just did the slow transition and it worked.
Lou: It's kind of Tim Ferriss four hour work week ish in a way of like, okay, how do I start? Not that you're outsourcing, but in some ways it's like, how do I do this but less? Or how do I step in a different role and create different space? So I think it's a very smart thing, especially if you're already doing something similar to what you would do on your own. It's like, how do you make your employer your client is a great shift to make.
Tiffany: Yeah. And I was so grateful that it worked. Yeah, I was very blessed and visualized it all the time and it worked out. And then I said I would never have a team again because I had a team in corporate and now I have a team again. So that was interesting and funny.
Lou: What's your opinion on canva? Everyone has the same templates and fonts and it's all like the same stuff. I'm curious if you use that tool or what your thoughts are on what it allows people to.
Tiffany: Yeah, honestly, the creators of Canva are just geniuses, first of all, because coming from using Photoshop and illustrator and all of the things to have that tool and it's free, they're just brilliant. I'm never going to leave my tools because I'm so used to them. And honestly, I don't design as much as I used to. I have my team that helps me with that, but I have to say that when it first came out, I was like, oh, I was mad and I thought it sucked. And I think just the true artist in me was like, this is crazy. Probably what true photographers thought of the digital camera when it came out. I don't know, I'm just guessing. And the more I use it because it's customizable now, it's fast, it's easy. My clients love it. So a lot of times when we're doing a brand for people, we'll do their website, we'll provide all their social media graphics. Well, of course they're going to want to edit it, so we give it to them all in canva. But as far as your point with the templates, I still say you need your own unique brand because otherwise you do. You'll see the same people using the same templates and it's okay. Like, you're not standing out there. So I truly love it as a tool, but I do believe that having your own look and feel and applying that to canva is the best solution.
Lou: While we're on tools and making things more streamlined, are you worried about AI in any way of taking over potential, making other people? It's easier to just create a brand through AI. And or what are AI tools you use in your business, whether it's branding or otherwise?
Tiffany: Yeah. So it's similar to Canva. At first I was like, oh my, is my whole business at risk? But honestly, the human touch, like I said, my job is to listen to people and create strategies and there's nothing like AI can spit out things pretty well, especially in messaging, but it's never going to have the same voice. So as far as the visual pieces go, especially with canva and everything, honestly, I could see that potentially taking over. I mean, there's already so many website tools. We still build custom websites that are going to look like nobody else's for people. But that's not my bread and butter because I know there's so many easy options. Where I use it most is definitely in social media. So when I work with people and do that deep dive, when we do the foundations, they walk away with like a 20 to 30 page document called a brand manual, which has the brand story, the vision, values, voice taglines, all of those things in it. So you could potentially put it in AI and be like, give me all this stuff. It's just going to be like a bunch of mumbo jumbo usually. But the cool thing with AI is you can train it. So I actually teach my clients once they have that brand manual how to train AI, then to use their brand voice, and it gets better and better over time. So once you have that locked in, then you can create content for ages for it, you can train it and export it, and it saves a ton of time and effort. So I'm all about it. I think the main thing I get concerned on is I was doing virtual and augmented reality in my corporate position, and it's all so amazing. And also it could be used for good and not so good. Right. And so I think that's rather than like, I'm not concerned about what I do because I'm always evolving and we'll figure out how to serve people the best way possible, but it'll be interesting, is all I know, because it's going to look completely different in ten years.
Lou: That's so true. Yeah. We met in an entrepreneurial mastermind, and I'm a big believer in being around others that are doing similar, different work, that understand just the mindset of growing themselves, of possibility. It was kind of the early part of what got me on my journey is a mastermind. So I love them. I'm just curious what your experience has been in masterminds or coachings or things that you have joined and how you decide or discern and just anything you want to share about that?
Tiffany: Yeah, definitely. I 100% agree with you. I think those communities are so important to create deeper relationships, and then you meet like minded people so much quicker. Like, we just hit it off right away, and you're like, you want to be on my podcast? Yeah. So I honestly just left Facebook. I just made the announcement the other day, know I'm not going to delete my account. And I still have my aunt message me, and was like, I want to see pictures of my niece. And I was like, well, I'll text you pictures. Like, okay. It's not like I'm never going to go on there or whatever, but I'm sure you know this more than anybody. Our minds need to be quieted, not just be filled with all of this junk all day. And it's gotten so toxic on social media, and I was just like, I'm over it. And so many people. What about your business? Because I did honestly start getting most of my clients on Facebook five years ago. But things are changing so quickly. So for me, community is the new social media. Like, I joined the community that we're in together because I could just tell it's like a beautiful, inclusive, really amazing place. So that's really what it is, for me, is like, who are the people in the community? The leader matters, too. But for me, if it's a true mastermind or true community, then it's like fostering the relationships with everybody. And I also run a community, mostly for women entrepreneurs, although I do work with men on branding stuff, because until I found the one that we're in together, I could not find a community that I loved that I wasn't spending. Like, I've been in some really high level masterminds that were $30,000 a year, and they were great, and I made great relationships, but I kind of got a little bit tired of spending a big chunk of my profit on masterminds. I'm not going to lie. I know that's very. I speak my mind, obviously.
Lou: Yeah.
Tiffany: And I didn't want to create a space like that for people either. I've built my business, I make good money, but I don't want to spend it all. So that's the thing I'm looking for now, is creating spaces and containers where it's a high enough investment, where people are going to show up and be present, but it's not so much where it's like you're spending all this money just to make great relationships, because that's what we do as human anyway. Right.
Lou: So how do you structure that kind of mastermind that you want to create? Asking very selfishly, as I'm hosting a mastermind currently, and it's a beta version, there's eleven people in it, and I'm still figuring out what works in it. So, yeah, if you have any insight, I'm curious how you run your groups and what that looks like.
Tiffany: Yeah, well, I love talking about this, too, because I think that's always evolving, too. Right. A lot of masterminds, there's not a lot of meat to it. It's more about networking, and that's cool. And then there's some that there's specific goals. So mine is for women, for networking, but it's also to make your message a movement. So it's an extension of the branding work that I do. So if you come and get a brand with me, well, then the next step, I mean, most people are already getting their message out there and doing social media, but I'm a trained speaker, so the backbone of the community is I'm teaching them how to create their signature talk, and then we meet in a retreat at the end if they'd like to, or they could do it virtual if they want to spend less money. So it stays inclusive. But if they can come in person, we actually do video of them giving their signature talk, then they have assets and they're truly stepping into that thought leadership thing. So I really like to have a backbone of you're completing something during the time in some format. Right. Or maybe I was in part of one a couple of years ago where we did it for 100 days and we did journaling and a little piece of art every day. And I'm on my 580th day of journaling now because it gave me, I would journal off and on, but it gave me that practice. So, anyways, I could talk about this for hours. Obviously. I love it, having that backbone, something that they're, like, executing or taking away, because I think that's the only other thing. Sometimes you're just kind of showing up and you make relationships, but you're like, just there, you're not accomplishing anything. Not that you also don't want to overwhelm people. Right. So there's that. And then I really love to focus on the people in the community being the expert. So I used to bring in guest experts, and that was cool. And I got to feature friends and colleagues and things, but then I realized that the people in the community were really experts, too. And so they love that because then they get featured in front of all the other people. And so that creates a really amazing space. And then another thing I did is, like I said, I ditched Facebook. So I went on to Heartbeat, which there's like circle and mighty networks, a couple different things, but I think that's one of the best things I did, which cultivates community in a different space. So it wasn't like people getting distracted on Facebook or not seeing the notifications. There was a dedicated space for the community that people could come and hang out on, and the replays are there and stuff like that. So I don't know if that's at all what you're asking for.
Lou: Yeah, 100%.
Tiffany: What came to mind.
Lou: Heartbeat is another tool, like a circle or a mighty networks.
Tiffany: Right.
Lou: Interesting.
Tiffany: Yeah. And I think I prefer it because I've tried all of them. I've been on all of them.
Lou: Yeah. So what I'm hearing is to have some tangible outcome. And I think the way that I'm running this mastermind, I kind of went anti that. I went, like, anti course, anti class, anti teaching that this is actually, in what I understand of a true mastermind, is, like, each person getting some time, the group comes together to support this person, and then hopefully there's action step or some clarity for that person. But that has its issues, I'm finding with eleven people. Right, because you have eleven people trying to go in 90 minutes. It's a lot of people and having multiple structures. So I'm still figuring that out process and playing with the different things. It's helpful to hear your thoughts and kind of how you think of it.
Tiffany: Yeah, no, I love that, though. I mean, really, it's all cultivated by your. I mean, going back to brand. Right. It's like how you do things. And mine isn't necessarily a mastermind. I call it a community. So it serves a different purpose. Right. But I think it's the true Napoleon Hill mastermind. Yeah, absolutely. Is to come together and support each other. What I have done, because we have that too. I forgot to mention, we have love seats where we come together. We just do it once a month, though, and then people just do a quick application because sometimes people don't really have anything that they want to share. And so we were like, who's really needing the support? And then they kind of take turns and then you can focus on less people each call. So that's an idea.
Lou: So you're meeting weekly with this community?
Tiffany: Yeah, we meet weekly and then we kind of rotate out each week. We do like a different. So we have love seats one week. I do a teaching one week, then we have a guest teacher from within the community another week, and then the last week is usually a support. It's like the mastermind session where people just come with whatever they want.
Lou: Yeah. Interesting. Okay, cool. Thanks for that. I appreciate this. I always get to learn so much when I have guests on. It's always, like a selfish thing for me. All right, so let's just come back here real quick. On leaving Facebook, does that also mean leaving Instagram? Does this just mean leaving social media in general and fully focusing on community, or are you still outwardly sharing in some way?
Tiffany: Yeah. So for right now, it's mostly Facebook. Instagram, I've definitely taken down. So I post usually two to three times a week there and then I've thought about reducing that to the nine grid. I don't know if you've ever seen anybody just, it's like a little like, this is who I am when you get to their page, but they're not updating it or they'll do stories. So that's probably my plan at some point next year. I didn't want to just stop everything at the same time, but I actually personally have been more on LinkedIn, I just found with business owners, which is so funny because I haven't been on there for years, but just the way things are shifting, I heard so many people saying, I'm back on LinkedIn. And I was like, this is a thing. And I went back on and it's like updated and then it's new and everybody is really active. And I was like, wow, okay. So I found that just to stay focused, there's less of the toxicity and things that can happen in the other spaces. And also you can curate your feed so you can kind of ignore things if you want to. But ultimately, my goal is to pretty much get off and focus on communities, partners, podcasting, speaking, because, yeah, it's. Or even if I do, it's just reducing it as much as possible.
Lou: I actually made a LinkedIn post for the first time ever because you're hearing all this energy and I'm like, let's experiment. Let's try it out. My niche and the people I talk to, I feel like it's. So I have a judgment where it's like, I'm not on LinkedIn, these are not my people. I'm not in the professional corporate world. I just have all these judgments. But I did a post and it went well. I ended up getting like one discovery call from it. So I was like, maybe there's something here. So I've been dabbling a little bit just when I feel called. So it's kind of fun to explore and experiment, and obviously we only.
Tiffany: Exactly. And that's where it is. Because depending on where your people are at, I'm going to start focusing more on Pinterest. Because when people think of brands, they're really going to Pinterest. So really Pinterest and YouTube, they're also search engines, so it's smart where people can actually, like, if they're searching for meditation. So I think rather than just the scrolling, like, maybe somebody will see this post, maybe they won't. I'd rather go to a more targeted place personally.
Lou: Quantum jumping. Quantum leaping. What was the book you read?
Tiffany: Oh, yeah, u squared. And then it's. I think it's. What's the subtitle is something about quantum Leap. The concept is making a quantum leap. Yes.
Lou: Okay. Any other. I know the quantum jumping maybe is not a book, but any books, maybe business specific, since that's where some kind of spiritual people maybe have a difficult time considering, like, okay, what's a business book to read? And maybe that can help them in their journey. Anything that you would maybe recommend or you've maybe just found helpful in your own practice.
Tiffany: Yeah, I'm trying to think specifically because I've read so many books. I'm actually going to look at my audible really fast because lately I've been more into the spiritual books. So I'm like, I have to think back to what's a spiritual book that's calling right now? I'm reading working with the Law by Raymond Hollywell. It's like a super old school book, but it's like the spiritual Principles, like Universal Laws, which is such a good reminder. It was actually from Mary Morrissey, and it's just been sitting in my bookshelf and I was like, oh, this feels like I need to bring it back.
Lou: Time. Yeah.
Tiffany: Yes. Oh, I know. I think it's not a super sexy book, but it's a good book. It's deep work by Cal Newport, especially if you're creative or spiritual. I could spend all day in meditation and journaling and making art and things. So I really love the idea of just really focusing on the deep work and getting way more done in a shorter amount of time. But it's not your typical productivity book. That's like, block your time for this. It's actually actionable.
Lou: Yeah, I think deep work is a sexy book to me.
Tiffany: Some people, if you really like the spiritual book, it's like, okay, but it's so worth it. That's what makes it sexy.
Lou: Yes. Any other tech tools that you use that you find helpful in your business?
Tiffany: Let me think. Well, I did mention Fathom earlier. So Fathom AI is a plugin on Chrome, and it will come into your Zoom calls with you. And so I use it all the time. Like I said, I'm constantly on Zoom calls, digging deep with clients, and so I take notes. But it's always good to have those recordings to go back to of like, oh, how did they say that? Or what did we talk about? So I really am loving that. Lately I use clickup for business geeky stuff. My project management tool, which has saved my life in so many ways now that we've grown, and I'm usually managing 20 website builds and different clients at a time, that's been really powerful. I'm trying to think what else? Chat GTP is good, of course, but a new AI tool that I've been trying out is Claude. C-L-A-U-D-E-I hadn't heard about it, and it's actually pretty amazing. It's similar, but its goal is to make helpful, harmless, honest AI. I guess so I just love that idea of it because chat GTP can be like, it's open and so they could be taking things from anywhere and you could accidentally be stealing other people's content without knowing about it. So Claude tends to do a better job at not just pulling from everywhere.
Lou: Thanks so much, Tiffany, for joining. Is there anywhere else you want to share about what's exciting, what's coming up for you? Anything you want to point people to?
Tiffany: I would just probably say at this point, my website is yourlegacybrand.com. Like I said earlier, I'm hanging out mostly on LinkedIn, which is interesting. So the last place would be my podcast, which we're on a little hiatus. We're going to move into season two in the new year. So the legacy lounge it's called, but you can find that on my website too. Is probably the best place if you want to connect or hear more.
Lou: Awesome. Tiffany, thanks so much for sharing your wisdom and time here. It's really appreciated.
Tiffany: Thank you, Lou. It was my so, so great and meditators are my people, so I'm glad to be here.
Lou: Yay. Love it.