THE STREAM w/ Darius Bashar: Building Community, Regenerative Creativity, & Authentic Podcasting
Friends! I'm so excited about this new episode format. You may already Love Darius, and if you don't know him yet, I know you will. Darius Bashar is a dear friend and previous podcast guest. This is a unique episode where we hang out and chat about creativity, business, podcasting, and much more. It was so much fun. I hope you like listening to us flow in THE STREAM of consciousness. Please reach out and let us know if you enjoy this format!
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Music Credit: Nova by River Roots - https://www.youtube.com/riverroots
Podcast Transcript
Lou: Darius.
Darius: Amigo.
Lou: What is up?
Darius: What's good?
Lou: Hey, there, friend. I'm so excited to see you.
Darius: Me too.
Lou: How was artist morning lit? Tell me about it.
Darius: Maybe one of the best lounges ever. Um, I was very behind in my morning because I was so enthralled by a creative idea, and usually I can't hold two ideas at the same time. I'm like, oh, man, it's artist morning idea time. And I got to the meditation late, and I just trusted my gut, and I was like, maybe this is, like, not the best one today, whatever. But it lit people up. It lit people up. The chat was exploding, and then the lounge was, like, just full of emotions and tears, and one person shared something that, like, rocked everybody, and then I couldn't, like, we went 95 minutes. We're supposed to go, like, an hour, and it was, like, the lounge, I extended to 30 minutes now, but, like, we went, like, five minutes, eight minutes past, and it was just lit. A few people messaged me, like, oh, geez. They're like, that was the best lounge ever. I was like, wow.
Lou: What was the topic?
Darius: Um, dreaming. Dreaming. Yeah. And there's just, like, a journal prompt that I sometimes don't know the journal prompts until, like, I hit, like, play on the meditation, and I'm, like, in the middle of the meditation, like, I should probably. I gotta come up with the journal prompt, because as soon as we come out, people are waiting for it. And it was a really good journal prompt that, like, activated borderline triggered some people.
Lou: Are you okay sharing it?
Darius: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Of course.
Lou: And by the. By the way, I went. I tried. I'm trying something new, and we're just, like, recording from the get as, like, to keep this casual. So this might also all be. I'm wanting this all to just begin the podcast before I even introduce anyone to you. And we'll get. We'll get to that. But I was, like, really wanting to do this differently, so if you've. Knowing that this will be. I would love to hear it anyway, but if you don't want to share it for a wider audience, um, what that prompt is.
Darius: Yeah, um, no, I have no problem sharing it. Uh, the only thing, my head went one. I I'm, like, so open. I'm willing to share anything except things that are someone else's private, you know? So I was just like, as you said that I was going through my head and being like, did I say anything that was inappropriate for someone else? And I don't think so. The journal prompt was what's on a spreadsheet? D. You don't even need to do the legwork. The journal prompt was, is there an idea or creation you silently gave up on? Maybe you always wanted to write a book, make a podcast, learn to dance, start a business, etcetera. Maybe you didn't consciously give up on it, but you stopped thinking about it and taking actions towards it. Take some time today to explore how you feel about letting that dream go. Are you ready to say goodbye?
Lou: Wow. That's not a journal prompt. That's, like, a journal, like book in, like, a great way. I love that.
Darius: I love.
Lou: Those are your prompts. I'm like, oh, I've been doing prompts. I don't do a lot of prompts, but when I think of how I would do prompts, that's so much more thorough than one question, which I love.
Darius: Yeah, they're different. They're different. And this spreadsheet I, like, couple of months back was like, oh, this is a book. Actually. This is gonna, like, all these questions, because there's a opening question, there's a journal prompt question, and then there's a closing question. I'm like this. I have hundreds of these that I've tested against, you know, an actual community. So I'm excited to, like, explore. Then. Some of them are, like, two, like, a four or five words. Really simple. Um, and sometimes I just don't know how the community will take them in, and the chat will let you know immediately.
Lou: So cool, man. How many people were there?
Darius: 100.
Lou: Yeah. Darius, it's incredible that you get, like, a hundred people coming on a Zoom each week. I always tell you this, like. Cause I'm always like, yeah. Just celebrating it, and it makes me smile to know, like, Friday. Sometimes I think of Friday mornings and, like, Darius being in his zone, like, doing. Doing artists morning.
Darius: Yeah, it's. It is incredible. And, like, so many people are on videos, and so many people are talking and communicating, and, you know, people have literally traveled across the globe to hang out because they met an artist. Morning. So it's. It's. It's like. It just keeps blowing my mind. It's a really cool space.
Lou: So, when you said dreaming, is it something that I heard you share? And I actually did a pretty flowy meditation for my Meraki mastermind group on Wednesday, where it was the last one of our cohort, and I used. Not used, but I referenced you when we were dropping into the meditation. It's something that I've really admired. You talking about was dreaming as a skill and kind of that opened up the prompt for just dropping into that meditation and inviting people to use the skill of dreaming. Cause I remember I even asked you a couple months ago, or I would, maybe it was in our mastermind, and I was asking about, you know, thinking about doing the first session, and I was saying, you know, yeah, I'm gonna have them, like, dream about, you know, ten years down the road so they can see their vision. And you were like, hey, man, wait a second. Maybe. Maybe they're not at that point yet. You know, they're just getting settled. Like, this is, like, a skill that they need to build. And I've always taken that. That comment to heart of, like, oh, yeah, this. This is not something that we are always trained to do. Or maybe we had it more connected to us when we were younger, but, yeah. So I'm just saying all that to ask, was that part of your practice today, or is it different kind of dreaming that you talked about?
Darius: I feel like it's always a part of my practice around. I've ran several dream workshops since I shared that, and I've kind of been doubling down on dreaming as a twin flame partner to creativity. Like, they're the same, you know, and it's a space I'm really excited about. And the more I lead workshops and make meditations and read comments, it's like, it's exactly. It's like some people are like, three weeks ago, I had someone, and she's like, I haven't had a dream in 30 years. And it was just like, whoa. You know? Like. And it was so. We were just sharing, and then she said that, and the whole room just got, like, so quiet. We're like, whoa. And over the course of, like, this two hour workshop, like, she kept unfolding in the most. Like, I got goosebumps because she was like, that was a lie. I have dreams. I'm just not oriented to see them. So many of my dreams have already come true. And it's like, I think some people think a dream is like, I want to win an Oscar. I want to win a Nobel prize. But it's like, we literally live in a dream museum. Anything you point at is a dream. Like, this was someone's vision. Like, this color is an accidental. The shape is an accidental. Like, there's not a single thing you can point at that wasn't a vision, a creative dream of some sort. Right? Like, every single thing is a dream. And when we realize that we're inundated by dreams, then our, you know, like, expectations from what a dream is changes. Am I allowed to surround this podcast, please? The last person to comment on the lounge said something like, and there's such a wide spectrum of experiences around dreams. She's like, I haven't had a dream. She said, all my dreams are dead. And she's a very interesting artistic person. And usually she, like, mic drops like that. She's like, all my dreams are dead, and they're all in body bags. And I forgot to remember that. Just because they're in body bags doesn't mean they can't still live. They can become Frankenstein's. And Frankenstein was fucking cool and fucking famous. I was like, damn. You know, like, obviously someone who has a different. There's a. There's a jadedness to dreaming. And now seeing that there's. There's something past the jadedness, you know, dreaming is really painful because so many of us have been told, like, don't be a dreamer. Don't be an idiot. You know, like, be. Be real. And, yeah, it's just really fun showing people that we're all dreamers and we're all living in a dream. It's just like, is it your dream or someone else's dream?
Lou: When you said, be real, I wanted you to say realistic, because that's always a term that I would think it's called be realistic. But when I say be real, there's a part of me that's like, what's real is the pursuit of the dream, or what's real is actually living a dream in some ways that actually. Maybe when I say when you think of real, of most alive, right? Most like tangible, but in a. Almost in a more spiritual sense, I think I'm maybe going down a rabbit hole here. I don't know if any of this lands, but what was the other idea that caught you off guard or took your attention this morning? That you had a sh shift? It sounded like.
Darius: It was mine.
Lou: Okay. And if you're not ready to share it, nothing.
Darius: I'm not down to share. So yesterday I had a shoot in the city. I'm a photographer, and it was like the first spring outdoor shoot of the year. And Toronto is like, New York is like, Chicago is like, a lot of cities. It's, like, buzzing. There's just, like, creative energy everywhere. And the place in which this shoot took place was like, kind of like the mecca of startups and ad agencies, but, like, cool creative ad agencies, not the big ones. And yeah, there's just, like, so many famous streets and so much famous just like, creative energy, and it was, like, the had the best time. It was just, like, it just activated all this creative energy and reminded me of, like, taking photos of strangers and what that was like. I was like, damn, I love this so much. I love that, like, my job as a photographer is to find beauty everywhere. You know, like, everyone's got a different job, and it's like, mine is to hone in my ability to see beauty and you and your hair and your be in your back in your. And the energy and the conversation. And I left this photo experience being, like, I feel so, like, just there's something electric happening, and I had to use the washroom in the middle of our shoot, and I walked into this hotel called the ace Hotel. It felt like an LA hotel. Like, it. I think it's probably in many cities, but it was like, there's a bar and lounge, and I was like, what is happening? It feels like everyone's writing a script. It feels like there's, like, big business meetings happening. I'm like, damn. So after the shoot, it's like, I could go home or I could ride this wave. So I randomly decided to go to the art store, and many years ago, I worked with this, like, kind of virtuoso, brilliant film director who went with me to the same art store and took, like, an hour and a half to pick a pen. I'm like, vinny, what are you doing? He's like, this isn't just the pen. This is how, like, God comes through, and you don't want a pen that's going to leak, and you don't want a pen that's going to stifle. You need just the right pen on just the right paper. So I'm like, 45 minutes in. Like, what's the right. Like, I need God coming through, you know? Like, how do I get that? Like, nice God flow. Finally found the right combo. Like, $70 later, two different. Like, there's a couple of them here. And then I'm like, I'm gonna go sit at that bar at the ace hotel and just see what happens. I ordered a delicious burger, sat there, put my headphones on, and, like, a whole book came through me. This book that was, like, all the pieces of me from the past coming together in this one thing, and I kind of just wrote, like, the outline for it. And that was what was in my dreams and in my morning. This morning, that took up a lot of energy. I kept. Kept going. This morning, I'm like, oh, I don't want to stop talking about this and thinking about this, and then I'm like, okay, what's the meditation that I need? And that's usually the prompt. It's like, what do I need today? And I needed a meditation that was full of affirmations to support me being that vessel for God to come through me.
Lou: That's such a example of when someone's looking to find if you need it, if you like it, like, if you are just. I had this experience this week with an email I wrote with the title Quantum Bone broth. It's actually a podcast episode, too. So the podcast episode is the. The problem with spiritual. In the spiritual coaching world, it's a whole other separate topic. But I was so smitten with this email, and maybe it's a little different than what you're sharing. It's not necessarily, like, what I needed. Maybe it is what I needed, but of just, like, creating for me. And I was so happy and smitten with myself with this. You know, I keep using that word, smitten. Cause that's how I felt. Like, I just. There's, like, a line in there where I was just like, I just keep laughing at it when I'm reading it. I was like, I don't know if anyone's gonna laugh at this. I'm laughing at it, and, like, that makes me super happy. And it was one of those, you know, sometimes I'll share something, and I'm, like, hopeful to get some feedback. And it was one of those ones where I was just so unattached to, like, hey, if someone responds or if this. I don't even care. Like, I'm just. I'm happy to, like, share this out there. So it's a little different from what you're sharing, but I think it points to, like, you know, the heart of maybe creating.
Darius: What's your ratio of those type of creations to the ones that are more pointed and strategic?
Lou: That's a great question. I would say when I'm writing for my newsletter, which in so many ways feels like this artistic creation, I have so much fun doing it. And there is, after a while, because you don't get, the thing with writing a newsletter is you don't get the instant feedback like Instagram would, that. If they even got a semblance of something from it, maybe they give a heart right? Or even if they're just scrolling. I'm, like, jaded with Instagram because it's funny. My partner makes fun of me because sometimes I'll just scroll, and if I just know the person. Maybe I don't fully engage with it, but I'll shoot a heart or whatnot. And she will say something. She'll tell me something. Oh, did you see what that person posted? And I was like, uh, no, I don't think I read that. And I was like, you like the photo? And I was like, oh, my bad. And so, like, I guess I have, like, I think that everyone experiences Instagram like that where they're not actually paying attention, just going through it and whatnot. And so, but to the receiver, dopamine hit. And so that feels good. And so I'm saying all that because when you're writing a newsletter, you're not necessarily getting those instant hits of people, like, receiving it, finding value. Like, it takes effort to reply to an email. Like, it takes energy to hit reply and say, hey, this resonated for me. And so, you know, depending, I would say it's a mix of there's a part of me that definitely wants more of that and hopes for that. And then I've learned, and this has been more just really as a practice getting out of my way to just keep sharing and trusting. I know that people are receiving this and, well, even when you. There's always going to be unsubscribes. And that's always sometimes painful on emails when you, like, share something. But sometimes, here's the difference is sometimes I'll share something and kind of be nervous if people unsubscribe. So this is a key, I think, what you're talking about, I would say when I think of it like that, when I share something and I'm nervous if someone unsubscribes, that's a sign that it's actually not the purest thing. Because when something is, like, so pure for me, where I'm, where I'm like, this is just it. And if people unsubscribe from this, good, because, like, this is me, you know what I mean? Like, this is if people don't get this or they don't like this, this is good. But sometimes when it's not at where maybe it is more strategy, I'm like, oh, maybe like, where I'm questioning it, I'll have concerns if there's that unsubscribe. But when I'm like, this is it, like, for that email, like, if someone unsubscribes to this, I mean, there's so many reasons why people unsubscribe. We don't have to get a whole conversation on that. But I'm like, okay, that's cool.
Darius: Is it even possible to have all your posts be that, like, grounded, fully believing in the content itself?
Lou: With email, it's hard to because it's deciphering. Because for email. Email for me is both, like, a marketing things and I'm also creating, like, content through it. Like, it's kind of. It's hard to understand the difference between. And so sometimes I would say I feel that more when it's more promotional. Right. It's maybe it's very more clear. Like, hey, I have a offering coming. Like, I'm looking for five people, you know, come here, right? Where it's just more basic ass. Like, that's obviously not like a creative act. But when I. Alright, let me get off of the email. Just because I feel, like, so much of my energy and, you know, I need not to, I need to judge it, but if I were to think of more talks or meditations, I say I feel like I have a lot less attachment. There was. I've actually. And this is. I'm curious to hear your thoughts on this, too. And I know we're kind of, this is what this is meant to be. We haven't even introduced what this is yet, which I love that we're 20 minutes in and I haven't even told people of, like, why we're having this or my intention for having this conversation. So we don't have to get there yet, but maybe we will at some point. But I gotta. You know, me and Darius both teach on insight timer. You might know Darius from insight timer. You might know him from, uh, Instagram or whatnot. But I haven't gotten impacted by a negative review in a long time. Until two days ago, someone leave. Left a review where it actually, like, salted me in a. In an interesting way, where I was, like, charged and I actually. It's like one of those ones where I didn't respond right away, but it's one I wanted to respond to. Normally, I'm just like, whatever. Like, it just has no effect on me. So I'm kind of moving away from your inquiry and was just curious of, like, your experience of that at the moment. And if you're getting. If. If you find your experience with maybe negative feedback or no feedback in general. So maybe we are on the same topic. Like, when you put something out there and don't get the feedback that you want. So I'll pause and push that question back to you.
Darius: So your question, so I'm clear, is my perspective around negative feedback or negative.
Lou: Feedback or feedback in general, too, right? If we were to just flip that question to you around, things that you're creating that you're hoping for a feedback or things that you're creating that are just, wow, I'm just so happy I can release this into the world and it doesn't even matter.
Darius: Yeah, it's an interesting question because it lets me see where I've changed a lot.
Darius: Yeah. Again, it's like very. Each platform is different. Like, I get real irked with lack of movement with Instagram because I've intentionally, like, I'm like, I'm not here to grow my following. I'm actually here to grow my business. That's my first priority right now, because if the business is not paying the bills, I can't do all the other things. So it's like, let's like, I got caught up in, like, virality. I went viral several times and I'm like, that just took up a lot of energy. And now that I have some space away from it, my income went down, my capacity went down, my people pleasing got triggered in a really negative way because there's so many people now. So I'm like, that can't be it. That's not that I tried it. I experienced, like, that's not it. So it's like, what are the actual sound business practices to create sustainability? And first and foremost, it's revenue. If you don't have revenue and then profit and your revenue, you're not going to exist. Right. I'm very, very into sustainable, regenerative initiatives and creativity. And so there's this weird thing happening where the posts I put up on Instagram that have the lowest engagement generate revenue at a much higher level. And so I was like, and I feel this thing in me that's like, Instagram has dangled this. Like, all your views are public, all your engagement is public. You know, like, make sure people can see that there's action happening here. And it's like, slow down. Is that the most important thing, what views I get or something else? So it's like, it's still bothering me. The revenue is going up, but the engagement is going down. And it's like my ego that's getting hit because it's like, I look at the content that I made before. It was the content that Instagram liked because their revenues went up, because it was a very different type of content. And so I'm like, I'm going to focus on my revenue before Instagram's revenue. But then there's this other that's like such a tiny, teeny little sliver of feedback. There's this other feedback that is rocking my world right now and has changed the way I do business for the rest of my life, which is pilot. Creating a pilot program where you bring people in early on and in community, develop a program, a membership, a course, whatever it is, and you're getting feedback. Very different type of feedback, tremendously valuable feedback, because you're hearing what they like, you're hearing what they need less of, what they want more of. You're hearing their language and their preferences and then converting that into landing pages and offers. And, you know, it's like that feedback is tremendously valuable because you have a true connection to your audience, your community, to your, you know, to fine tune the offering. You know, it's kind of like this. You know, I use this analogy a lot. It's like the other way of going away, figuring things out and then presenting it to your audience and saying, here's the thing that I've already spent all this time, energy and money on, is like a comedian testing jokes to an empty, you know, bar or event hall. It's like you need the feedback. You need to know what gets the laughs and what falls flat. And so there are many more important forms of feedback than likes. And, you know, and the other thing, from the beginning of our conversation, we were like, I think a lot of us have changed the way we interact with social media because of a variety of reasons. For me, and I bet you there's a lot of other people here, we know the algorithm is catching us. So I sometimes won't comment or like on a post because I'm like, now the algorithm is going to send me 25 notifications of other people who have commented on this post, scattering my concentration. And I'm like, I read the thing. I don't want to continue being pulled into this conversation every time there's a new comment or, you know, so it's like people's interactions with how that stuff works has shifted and changed a lot. And all of us have examples of people who have sent us an email after years of never liking or sharing or commenting on any post saying, I've been following you for years and your work has like, changed my life. And you're like, none of that shows up in these traditional social media metrics.
Lou: It's so tough because there's the part of me that wants to build the brand, right. Like everyone that I know, well, it's not true. What I'm about to say is not 100% true, because I actually maybe half inspired by hearing how you engage with Instagram and deleting it from your phone and then reinstalling it when you want to publish something. But I actually had it. I had it deleted from my phone. I have it deleted from my phone right now. And I had it for a month and a half where I didn't post anything. And I was just like, let me just experiment. Let me see how I feel. Let me see if I notice anything business wise. I've never noticed anything because nothing really comes through there for me. So it's different when your business is dependent on it. And just the other day, I did a post of just wanting. I'll be shameless in this. I did a post where I hadn't really talked about shaving my head. And so I did a post on, like, why I shaved my head when I shaved my head. And then I made a hardcore right turn to, uh, okay, what else? Well, I don't really spend time on here. And if you want to hang out with me, uh, and if you're this type of person, go follow me on my newsletter. Go subscribe to this. Like, I made a. I knew this would get traction, right, of me having this shaved head. Everything was authentic and true about it. And then I'm like, I want. Because I want to. I'm trying to send people off of Instagram to hang out with me in newsletter. And, uh, it's. It's. It's this challenge that I face with because I know that the brand. And we talked about this with our friend Saqib, right? Sakeb was growing on Instagram, and it's helpful for a brand when someone's like, okay, who is Darius Bashar? You know, I go to Darius's Instagram profile, I see 100,000 followers or 99,000 followers wherever you're at. And I'm like, oh, snip. This guy is the real deal. This guy is legit, right, beyond whatever that interaction is. And so I know that that's obviously insanely superficial, but I rest of. I rest with. I wrestle with. Okay. And I kind of lean towards, like, trusting myself, trusting that that's actually okay if that's not happening. And just like, a Sarah blonde and, you know, Sarah Blonde, never, I'm sure, had the strategy to grow her Instagram following, and she might post once a quarter on there. And it's. She's doing. She's doing okay. Which I go, you know, a lot of people probably listening to this know, and I know who Darius, you're super inspired by, too, her lifestyle and the choices that she makes. I think we could take this in nine different ways. I was curious, just because I didn't hear from you recently, how is the pilot feedback and creation going with what you've been working on and maybe just sharing, if you're open to it? Sharing a bit about what, what that is, what you've been working on with that?
Darius: Sure. Yeah. So maybe people here believe they know because you said, I'm an insight timer teacher. It's part of a community I have called Artist Morning, where we meditate, journal and celebrate as a community together once a week on Fridays. That community has grown substantially and there are a lot of superfans and a lot of people looking to go deeper with me and do more together and have seen the power of, like, growing in community. So I launched. I wanted to launch a membership program for people who wanted to go to the next level. And I was going to do it the old fashioned way of like, go away, come up with the thing. Here's the page. Are you interested? Come join. Refine, refine, refine. And I've done that before and I'm like, why am I going to do that? I'm different now. I've grown. There's community here. I can just, like, ask and say, hey, there are ten people who want to do a pilot with me for the next six weeks and we'll refine this thing together. I'll listen to you. Very quickly, I realized ten was not realistic. I think like 70 people emailed me saying they were interested. 55 people actually joined. We have to split it into, like two days, Tuesday and Wednesday. And very quickly we realized, oh, I can actually have people in both days. And the general premise is I'm going to help people get shit done. I'm really good at getting shit done through using the power of opening our creative channels. There's tools and tips that I use to help people do that. I use myself. One is this co working where we log in online and share what we're going to do? It's kind of, it's like, so silly. Like, and this helped me a lot because I'm like, why are people going to log into Zoom and co work with me? They can just do this themselves. What. What am I bringing to this? That was like the negative voice and it's like, dude, why are people going to meditate with you on Zoom? Meditation is literally the simplest thing in the world. Close your eyes. You're meditating, right? Are you meditating in an effective way? No, you need someone to come and say, I'm going to give you some structure and some guidance. So this very simple thing that is elusive to so many of us. I'm like, oh, the parallels are so similar. Right. I'm going to give you some structure in this two hour time block, and we're going to have fun, and we're going to laugh and celebrate and support each other. And there's something in the ADHD, ADHD community. It's called body doubling. Are you familiar with that?
Lou: No.
Darius: It's like this concept of, like, I don't want to do this task and I just need you, Lou, can you just sit in this room with me while I do this task? That's basically what we're doing times, like, 30, because there's, like, 29 other people in each room, and we're just like, what do you. And it's like, so people have realized, like, bring the task that you're struggling with, the thing that you haven't been able to do on your own. Darius will break it into these, like, Pomodoro 25 minutes blocks, and then we'll get it done. And people are so surprised how much we're getting done. So that's, like, one part of the membership. The other part is there's classes where I can share deeper lessons with people around creativity, confidence, and, like, building momentum. Um, and I'm sharing some of my, like, courses. So there's going to be some stuff online there. So it's like, yeah, it's been going amazing. It's been going better than I ever expected. And the other thing about it, when you say yes a little earlier and get people in, you know, like, everyone always talks about the negative side of people pleasing. Everything in life has a toxic side and, like, a virtuous side. I wouldn't make all these meditations that there weren't people on Friday morning waiting for me. Like, where's the next med? Right? And so now that people know there's an official end to the pilot and we go public in May, like, I have to get the stuff ready, right? Because I told them I would. So it's really helped expedite things from, like, what would have took six months or forever. It would have never got done to, like, damn, I'm figuring out how to do it all in six weeks.
Lou: The. What was the thing called? The ADHD double? What?
Darius: Body doubling.
Lou: Body doubling. It struck this memory of me being, this might be too much information for people, but it was a little kid, so it's, it's cute, but like being like maybe like seven or eight years old. And to go to the bathroom, I would need my dad, like in a public place, I would either need my dad to stand outside the door or if it was a stall, he would have to put his foot under the door so, like, I could make sure he was there. And so you sharing that baby, like, like think of, oh, wow. Yeah. I needed that weird, weird support of just someone just being there to like feel safe enough or support enough to do whatever the business of that, that time, that time is.
Darius: That's exactly it. Yeah. That is one incredibly cute image to imagine your dad's foot just coming through. But we all need it. And there's just like, it's like what I've realized about this community and this process is, it's like we're all pouring energy. This is the craziest thing. It's like 30 people, everyone's videos on, like 30 strangers, everyone's videos on. And like, people message me. But like, what if I want to stretch for my 1st 25 minutes block? I'm like, amazing stretching. Do you don't think stretching is important for like, sustainable growth? You know, so as I'm building this next level of membership, it's really cool to like, think about the DNA, think about the values, you know, think about what I don't want to pass on to this community and think about what I want to pour into this community around. Like, it's really important to me to be thinking not from a, let's compete against each other. Let's see who can do more and let's burn out and be exhausted by the end of this two hour deep dive. But, but it's like, literally people have taken naps. They're like, I'm going to take a nap for the second dive. I'm like, amazing. You want to put your video on, leave it on, whatever you're comfortable with. Someone's like, I'm going to stretch. I'm going to make a meal. Like, all of those things are important to sustainable creative expression. So you're templating it by leaving your video on and showing us what you're doing. And it gives someone else permission to be like, I need to stretch today. I really do need to sleep. I shouldn't feel guilty to sleep. I need that. It's going to give me more energy.
Lou: I love that. It's like you're, you create this world, right? We get to create a world when we create anything and it's this culture, like, we get to imbue the culture of that. That is the energy of, I would say, why people are more, you know, they're. Yes, they're getting their things done, but there's something even on a deeper level that I'm sure is. Is nourishing about just being in that space. It's how I think about showing up in Meraki mastermind as well, is like, there's a culture and an energy in here that I'm starting to. It's starting to get even more palpable. And in so many ways, like, this is the thing that matters more than, okay, what exactly are we doing today? Or, you know, yes, those parts are important. And having the strategy, but just thinking of the culture, the values, the mission, I mean, there's a reason why companies, like, focus on that. And sometimes it can be inauthentic because that's just a thing to do. But I think when you're doing it from that place, like, yeah, there's this transmission that is felt when doing that, and you're reminding me of, and I'm so happy for this permission. I've been in a men's group for about a year and a half, and it's super casual, it's co led. And sometimes I don't want to go. I have a lot of. There's a lot of things I could say about my men's group, but at the heart is really good guys, and also guys that are different than me. And I actually value being in a space where I, like, I don't know if I would hang out with this guy in normal life, but there's actually a huge value in having different beliefs or different, like, different. Different experiences of life that I find. Cause I know their heart is in a really good place. But there was one. One time on our men's group, one of the guys literally just took a nap. Lily was taking a nap the whole time while we were, like, going around. And it was so refreshing and felt so nourishing to have him still be in the group taking a nap. Do you know what I mean? Like, the fact that we were still doing, like, this work, and he's just there, like, taking what he needs in that space. It's really about coming and receiving what you need has. Has been really nourishing to give myself that permission. Like, on Tuesday, I dropped in and I'm just. I'm just going to lay on my bed and be on this and feel, okay, not really engaging. And it sounds like what you're creating is kind of in a similar spirit, which is really, really special. And I love that. I love seeing you give the artist morning community. What I'm projecting on is they're wanting. They're like, I love this. How can I. What else? What else, Darius? How can we go. Go deeper, have more of this community, more of this lounge energy that I'm feeling at, you know, at the. At the end of our sessions?
Darius: Thank you, brother. Yeah. I think it's a very special thing of what you're talking about. Like, it feels special for a group led by a guy to be like, hey, you're allowed to take naps. It feels extra special for a men's group because men are often, like, the burn, go harder, faster, like, you know? And it. I feel. It feels refreshing and feels hopeful that you're in a men's group that allows that, you know, instead of, like, grinding him down and, like, what do you know? Like, it's like, no, that's what we're about. This next level of the planet, I'm hoping is less about burn things down and, you know, like, you probably grew up like me. Like, grinding was a virtue. You know, I'm grinding, I'm hustling, you know? And it's like, we've kind of seen that that didn't get us to a great place. There needs to be a more sustainable path forward, and maybe that sustainable path involves more naps.
Lou: You're. You're triggering this. I don't know. Have you seen, um, inside by Bo Burnham on Netflix?
Darius: No.
Lou: Oh, man. I don't know if you're a Bo Burnham fan.
Darius: Wait, I have. I have. I have. He's the dude. It was, like, all in his. Like.
Lou: Yes. And he wrote it, recorded it, edited it, did the whole thing. I think it's. It's. It's from.
Darius: To me, genius.
Lou: Genius piece of art. Yeah.
Darius: Yeah.
Lou: You're reminding there's some joke in there, and I'm gonna botch it because I'm trying to figure it out on the spot. But he was like, yeah, you know that. That thing we did where we just let everyone have a phone and be on social media all the time and just see our lives? You know, that thing we did, maybe that wasn't a great idea. It was something to that sense where I think he described it a lot more, but it was like, maybe that didn't work out. So you just kind of.
Darius: It was pretty good delivery by you.
Lou: It wasn't bad. It actually wasn't bad.
Darius: It was pretty good.
Lou: I should give myself some credit for that.
Darius: Yeah.
Lou: So welcome to the art and business of Meditation podcast.
Lou: 41 minutes in, and maybe I'll just take a moment to share and you might be sensing this feels like a different podcast interview than I've done before.
Darius: Loving it. This is great.
Lou: Amazing. And that's what. That's what I wanted to do. So just to kind of let people in on my vision, and I kind of let you in on this vision, Darius. But I'm a fan of Tim Ferriss. He's probably been a guide for me for the last ten years in many ways, listening to his podcast, and he's an example. And this could be a conversation we go into from this. But his story, for those that don't know, he wrote a book that was really popular called the four hour workweek, and kind of was one of the early catalysts for people starting to figure out how to live a lifestyle that they did meaningful work, but they also were able to do things that they loved in different capacities. So he was able to teach a lot of people how to do that and wrote a couple more books because that book became really popular. And then he just really got burnt out by books and was like, you know what? People are starting to do podcasts and I feel like I'm just going to try it. And he gave himself six episodes. He said, this is just for fun. This is for me. I'm making big changes and I'm just wanting to explore a new creative outlet and just test it. And so he gave it six episodes and found out how much he was nourished by it. He appreciated it. And long story short, it's a hugely popular, millions and millions of downloads, podcasts. He has insanely guest celebrities, if you want to check one out. Jamie Foxx, like back in 2015, is an incredible episode to listen to. And in the show, one of his first episodes, maybe the first or second episode, was with his friend, this guy named Kevin Rose. And what they did was just chat and random, like talk random things. They literally called it the random show where they would just talk about things they were interested. They didn't say we were working on, ask each other questions. And it was just like two buddies chatting. And as I was thinking this week, this is maybe not the only reason to have this conversation, but for those listening, this became. It keeps becoming crystal clear to me. Darius is something I haven't shared with you, that out of that, you might be even more than my partner, the person in my life, that when I get any feedback from on, like the things I'm working on or creating that I take almost 100%. And not to say that I'm totally letting go of what's true for me, but there's. I say that in a way where it feels like you at least see me in the way that I'm wanting to show up and you're able to offer and also just your experience. Like, there's something where even more than my partner, like, her feedback on work or things or things I'm doing on, I'll. But for whatever reason, like, it's. And in and I. It's not like I'm doing it haphazardly. It continues to work out. True. It's like, okay, I'm glad I made that decision. I'm glad I took that. This felt right. So it continues to just keep working on so. So out of, you know, anyone. Like, you're the person in my life where if, like, you give me feedback on something for a manifesto in human design is saying a lot, because for me, it's like, I'm going to do things my way regardless of whatever you tell me. It's kind of the f. You. Like, I'm going to do things how I want to do it. So I say that backtracking to say that I was like, oh, it'd be fun to just. I think it would be fun for me. I think it'd be fun for you. I think it'd be fun for us, and hopefully, maybe it's fun for the people and if not, whatever, to get back to what we were saying before. But I'm like, so I sent Darius a message and was just like, hey, man, would you like every. Darius was a guest on this podcast. It was crazy to think that when you were actually a guest on this podcast, it wasn't this podcast. It was the awakening to purpose podcast. It was our first time meeting, and I invited Darius to join my little mastermind that I had right after, literally right after we hit record. And it's been a beautiful journey since, and he hasn't been back on. So welcoming Darius back on now in this new format and wanting to this to be just like a quarterly show, like, where people can expect, like, I'm excited for Lou to have Darius back on and do this thing that they do, which is just talk about things that they're, like, exploring and give feedback or advice in different ways. And so I sent Darius a message and said, hey, man, would you be interested? And, I don't know, keep a cat whenever, like, every couple months, three months, you know, we just hop on and just, like, do the. We got to name it. Maybe the audience can help us name it Darius. Maybe we can come up with a name. Like, they call it the random show. Kevin and Tim on their show. So we should call this, like, a show, though. Like, this should be a show where, like, oh, I see it. And they're. You know, Darius and Lou are back with the something show. Or maybe it's not a show because we're not performing. I don't know. I don't know. So that's my long winded introduction to the people here of why you just got on this podcast episode, and we just started talking. Because this is the spirit of. Of just wanting to hang out with my buddy and talk about these things that light both of us up and are super fun. And, you know, we're already, like, uh, almost a full hour in, and it feels like I. We haven't even, you know, started talking, which is the essence of energy, because we talk about regenerative content or, like, doing things that actually nourish and actually give energy, and. And I had to resist. I had to resist intentionally, like, no, Lou, you don't have to think about writing questions before this. No, Lou, you don't have to prepare for this to really trust that I know I'm going to get on the. On this conversation, and we're just going to have a good time, and. And hopefully, people enjoy it. And if they don't, at least we had a good time. All right, ramble over.
Darius: Oh, okay. So, thank you. Damn, that's amazing. I'm really, really touched by you sharing what our conversations and my feedback mean. So, the people at home know in, like, zero, zero one seconds, I replied to your suggestion of doing this podcast. Do you remember what the reply was?
Lou: It was a 1 trillion, trillion, trillion trillion. I don't know. A lot of zeros. Percent.
Darius: Like, 1 billion%. Yes. Exclamation mark. Exclamation mark. Exclamation mark. I love these conversations. I really enjoy our conversations. I love this format because it does feel regenerative. I don't know why. I don't really think about the audience. Like, my favorite podcast to listen to are those rare podcasts where two experts in a field forget the mics exist, and they're just like, as peers. Just like, yo, I found this thing. How did you do that thing? Oh, my God. And they forget that there's anyone else around, and those feel really precious, you know? And I. Yeah, it's just like, I think we speak about some interesting things for us. Maybe other people will find it interesting. That's cool. I love the idea of just making it casual, because as a photographer, as a podcaster, it's like this weird thing happens. When the mics show up and the camera show up, people's voices change and their posture changes, and they answer the same question you asked them a moment ago, completely differently. You're like, you know, I've hosted a few podcasts, and I was like, I would talk to people on my couch beforehand. I'd ask them a similar question. They give me the best answer. Or after the podcast, and then you turn the mics on, and you're like, what? Why are you giving this answer? Your answer, just a moment ago, was so good. And so the more we bring that casual vibe, I think the deeper the nuggets and the more fun we'll have. So, feels like a no brainer for me.
Lou: So, question for you. When I brought in and welcomed people to the podcast, did that change the felt sense of our conversation, where it's like, okay, now Lou is paying attention to the audience, and now it feels different?
Darius: Not for me. Not for me, to be honest. But this is probably my, like, 400th podcast. So it's like, I just. I don't know. There's something about the one on one experience that's my favorite. I'm just here with you. It's like, it's so hard for me to think about others, you know? And we're just here. And the paradox is, that's the best content, the content that you make just for you. Which loops back to our earlier conversation.
Lou: Yeah. Yeah. It's hard for me being a performer, in some ways, of enjoying performing and not always coming at everything like there's a performance. And so I find this walk or this tightrope of, yeah, how often this is, you know, wanting. Let's just not even talking about our conversation, Darius. But maybe. Maybe you can help me think of when I'm having interviews with people that I'm just meeting for the first time, or people where I have specific questions. And I think what I'm running into in the podcast is, you know, I have a set list of questions, and I'm interviewing maybe similar types of people, and I think they're different. It seems like people are receiving different things from them. But for me, one thing I heard about in, from Tim Ferriss, actually, when he said the number one thing when he thinks of guests is he wants to be interested in having fun. And when he's not interested in having fun, then he doesn't think the audience is interested in having fun. And sometimes I find actually, the thing I least like doing from the podcast, like, the thing that I don't. I don't want to do. And it actually creates a lot of resistance for me, reaching out to guests is I. I dislike. It's a slog for me to prepare for the guests that comes on. Like, I don't like that work. I do it because I also don't want to be the guy. I don't. I want to have some preparer. So I don't. I don't want to. I want to feel, because I know people that have podcasts where they're not. And I can see sometimes the effect of no preparation. And it's like, I don't want that. But it's also, I really notice it that when I have a podcast on Tuesday and on my schedule on Monday is prep this interview, that doing that is not fun for me. Like, there's actually almost no fun. Like, it's a resistant for me.
Darius: So who's your favorite part of the podcast experience?
Lou: The. My favorite part. I love my solo episodes a lot because I'm able to. Because I like to hear my voice and not other people's voice. I want to promote myself, not another person. Darius, you know that I think I've. I used to judge, I used to not think that I could get on a mic all of my insight timer stuff. For the most part, all my courses are written and scripted, and I know exactly what I'm saying, and I able to say it in a way that doesn't feel like I'm reading it, but I'm reading it for this podcast, I might have, like, an idea of what I want to talk about, but what I've let myself allow because it feels like I'm not putting any pressure on it to say, yeah, this is a topic I want to talk about. Hit record. Hey. Welcome. And I've surprised myself with my ability to stream of consciousness in a kind of structured way, but have fun with just talking and not having a script. And so I've loved that. Like, that's been. Because it's taught me that I can do that, and that's given me permission to show up to other public spaces and trust that I can just come on and talk about things that are true and that I care about. Without rehearsal, there's my performer. Without preparing. And so I love that piece, and I really love the. The networking piece of getting, of interviews of, like, making new connections. And there's also times in the podcast, not always, but where I do get really nourished by what the person's saying. By like, oh, I didn't expect this, or something new here, or I can really feel the heart of this person and inspires me, inspires me to do something new and inspires me to think about something new. So those times can't be forced. But I do appreciate those times with interviews.
Darius: Jeff, what do you think differentiates the excellent podcast from the average podcast?
Lou: So, podcasts I listen to, Tim Ferriss, Lex Friedman, Joe Rogan, those are the interview style podcasts I listen to most, I would say. And I mean, what I love about Rogan is more of what you're saying. Like, there's not. Joe Rogan's never, like, I'm gonna, like, have the best questions. You start those podcasts in the middle of a conversation, which I, like, really appreciate. And Lex is similar. Like, I like Lex's heart. I think, like, I like, I can sense even though he's a guy I never thought I would like based on the external of Lex and. Cause it's more like techy thinking. But actually Lex has this heart that I never. That I was surprised because I didn't know him. Cause I was judging based on what I saw on YouTube or this. But once I actually heard him, like, his interview with Rick Rubin is incredible. There's an authentic heart. Tim has been a mix for me of heart, like, seeing his. Him grow from hustle grind startup to more spiritual meditation. Seeing his heart open or what, you know, what I'm projecting on his heart opening, his compassion opening through that journey of me listening to him. So, yeah, it feels like there's different things in that and then. But there's the. So there's then the podcasts I listen to that I consider separate from. I want to listen to an interview where I actually like. Like, I follow this one podcast, and I go on and off with listening to it. It's around. It's for human design manifesters, or it's a pod. Or I follow a podcast that's maybe more business focused, like online marketing podcast. And that I like the 1415 minutes hit of this. This is. This is very niche, and you're hitting a very specific thing for me. And so I hope so when I'm speaking this out loud, it's like, I hope that some people are coming to this podcast finding that in the at least solo episodes and are they finding the authentic. I hope they're finding the heart in the interview episodes. But are they finding the. What we're doing now in those episodes? I mean, I don't do this with everyone, so I don't. I don't. I don't. I'm not sure.
Darius: Could I share what my answer to that question is, please? So, one, I've hosted maybe, like, 30 podcasts with guests, and I've come to discover I really don't like it. I really like. It's a lot of pressure. The research. I just get in my head around, like, oh, man, this isn't, like, the answer I was expecting, or this answer is like, I didn't get something juicy. It's like a very, like, oh, man, this person's been talking for, like, five minutes and hasn't really said anything, you know? And then I judge myself, and I judge, like, and then I've been guests on podcasts, and I was like, this is the best. Don't need to research. I just. It accesses my flow of consciousness. It's the best way I know to, like, get really juicy answers. Doesn't require any prep work. And then I was like, I'm just like, it's just not my thing. I have to put, like, 500% energy to get 80% outcome, 70% outcome. It's not regenerative. It's burning energy. I love solo podcasts because it's like, then I'm just. I love that stream of consciousness thing, too. And for the podcasts, I particularly love, like, right now, I'm obsessed with the podcast. Talk easy with Sam Fragozo is just incredible. So it's like, it's a combination of, like, incredibly curated guests, actors, directors, painters, photographers, Nobel prize winners. He is the best interviewer, I think, on the planet, maybe ever. He's 30 years old, and he's just like, like, everyone. Everyone is just kind of like, dude, how did you do the research for this? So he's like, I think he has to have a journalistic background, and he'll find every single thing ever written on that guest and quote them on it in a beautiful, artistic, like way. But what I think makes a really amazing. And this is why I wasn't great at this. Cause I just wanted to do the solo podcast. I just wanted to be the guest. But, like, it's like, it's an alley oop. It's always an alley oop. You know, I think a lot of podcasts, like, for example, Aubrey Marcus, who's really interesting in lots of different ways, but his podcast kind of make me infuriated because he talks so much. It's like, dude, I've heard you talk so much. I'm actually here to hear your guests who I've never heard before. Can you just lob them and let them slam it? You know, I want them to slam it and then. And then do the solo podcast. If you want a, like, thing where you want to go deep dive, because then it's just you, then I know I'm coming just for you. But he doesn't really do that. He'll, like, take up probably a lot more space than the average host. So it's like, I really appreciate someone who is skilled at that alley, you. And allows me to see this person in a deeper way than I would have previously.
Lou: Yeah. You're making me realize that I'm not that guy, and I don't really need to be that guy. I feel like me and Aubrey maybe have more similarities. I have a lot of. Sometimes I love Arby, and I also have judgments towards Arbery. There's two. There's two parts of me with Aubrey Marcus, but I don't know what you.
Darius: Mean when you're not that guy. I've been on a podcast, but, like, you were really great at that.
Lou: Sure, sure. Maybe I don't go on, like, 30 minutes diatribes, but I think it's fun for me. It's fun for me to respond, at least. At least my thoughts and shares, like, from what you're saying on a podcast, right?
Darius: Like, response is a part of the alley oop, right. Because it's actually illuminating something new. It's get. It's like. It's like I listened to a podcast with, what was his name? Blink. Malcolm Gladwell and M. Night Shyamalan. And it's like there are two people at such high levels of creativity, and he would lob it and answer these questions, and then every once in a while, he give his answer to that question because it actually got you deeper into the question. Right. So there's definitely room for that. It's not just like a robot asking questions, but it's a slippery slope to, like, now, I'm going to say the same thing I said 4000 times before and take up this. There's something about, like, really valuing the audience's time, you know? And being like, this person is deeply interesting. I've curated this person. And how do I bring the most interesting thing about this person to light?
Lou: I have something that feels edgy, for sure, but it's like. It's stuff that comes up for whatever reason as I speak. This out loud. There's like, and I'm curious your experience. But when I say I like Joe Rogan, I have this part of me that's like, is that safe to say? Like, am I going to be like, canceled for, like, for liking Joe Rogan? Like, there's this, it's not safe to.
Darius: Say and you're not going to be canceled, but it's not safe in the current climate. And the climate is changing because I think a lot of people are realizing, like, we are canceling people who could be our allies. These are good humans because they like one thing and they're not throwing everything out. Like, we can't afford canceling everyone because it, one, takes away the magnitude of canceling, which is such a terrible concept. Uh, and two, we're, we're actually like chopping ourselves down because Lou is a good guy. And if you're going to cancel this good guy because he listens to a variety of different perspectives, then you are so frigging short sighted that you're missing it.
Lou: Well, I always think with, with people that, you know, we love, and I, and I do the same.
Darius: Right.
Lou: We all judge what, we judge things that we have no experience of. And so I would just encourage anyone who, like, has a judgment to what the media would say about Joe Rogan and all of that. And sure. That he has some people on there that I don't. I haven't listened to Joe Rogan in months, to be honest. But when he does have someone that I engage with, like, just, you can tell, I think I'm a good judge of where people are coming from and their intentions and their heart in something. And you can tell he's not like he's coming at these conversations with such a, with, in a unique way, which is, I think, why it's the number, it's an insanely, it's why I think there's, it's the most popular podcast in the world. So I just, I say that to people because there's people that judge, that might judge it based on not actually listening ever to an episode of. And he has some that are kind of outrageous. And I think I love him. I'll, I'll, I love Hamid. Dust, do you know who, um. Oh, my gosh. I can't believe I'm blanking on his name. No way. No. Dust. Is it Dustin? Uh, Duncan Trussell. Do you know who Duncan Trussell is? He's, and I love Duncan Trussell because he, he, he walks this line and I, and I don't know if you have to jump on. I know. I actually have a coaching call in ten minutes, but Duncan Trussell walks this line of this comedian, this devout Buddhist, like he has on his podcast, Duncan Trussell family Hour. He has Jack Kornfield on. He has Krishna Das. He's in this, like, the Ram Dass Jack Kornfield Dharma lineage. And he's also this completely outrageous comedian. And him and Joe Rogan's podcast together are, like, 4 hours of this creative. Just. It's just, like, where these people. Mine. Mine goes in this time, or they wear, like, fun things, like, they'll dress up and they'll have their podcast conversation together. Dude, he's. His. His podcast is. Sometimes I listen to his podcast. I listen to his podcast a lot because his intros are just absurd. It's unique every time, and the way this guy's mind works is, like, I want to know. It's. It's unbelievable. So, yeah, I think you would actually. His artistry and the way that his mind works is. Is so wild and fascinating. Alas, I do need to prepare for a coaching call. We need to call this a show. I don't know what it is. Do you have any last words you want to say before we close this, whatever this is?
Darius: Um, I don't know what the name of the show is, but I'm down for naming it. And, no, this was fun. This is, like, again, again. Joe Rogan, the most popular podcast in the world, started with just friends talking. He wasn't interested in, like, traditional success. He did, I think, like, hundreds of episodes before anything actually happened. He broke all the rules by making them, like, three, 4 hours long. So I, you know me. I love experimenting. I love real conversations, and so I'm down, man, this is fun. Let's do it again.
Lou: Awesome. Please. Hey, if you're listening to this to bring the audience back in focus, let us know if this resonated. Go check out Darius on insight Timer Instagram and see what he's got going in artist morning. Drop into a meditation and catch us again next time whenever we do this. So thanks for listening.
Darius: See ya.